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Post by femoralis on Aug 13, 2006 23:05:15 GMT -5
Hello. I am from Argentina and have a tiercel harris hawk born in Nov 2005.
Here we are in winter now and it has been quite cold, like around the 30's F. My hawk started having some brown spots in the feet and now suddenly they got swollen and the spots got terribly worse last week.
I got it to a vet and told me she was afraid it could be the consequence of eating some herbivore animal that eated plants infected with some fungus (Claviceps sp), and so got some mycotoxins that could produce isquemia due to ergotism.
She was not sure of this condition, and she was also considering a possible infection with Stafilococus.
I am really worried by the evolution of the feet of my Harris, and am sending a SOS to those of you guys who may be able to help.
Searching through the web, I got an article called:
Wing Tip Oedema and Dry Gangrene in Birds of Prey
Neil A Forbes BVet Med Cbiol MIBiol Dip ECAMS FRCVS
and don't have an idea if this could be the case.
I wish I could paste a picture, but I cannot with the "insert image" button.
Please, I will appreciate anyone who may have an idea of what this is, to post me some hints and if possible an idea of treatment.
Best regards,
femoralis
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Post by frootdog on Aug 14, 2006 1:49:41 GMT -5
Is the bird outside? If so it sounds like frostbite to me.
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Post by femoralis on Aug 14, 2006 8:24:22 GMT -5
Hello. No, it is not outside, but the place where it is is very well ventilated and not heated. For sure if it was freezing outside, the temps may have been similar inside there. But there are many harris that live around here, and I wonder how they don't get this, and the same to all birds around.
In case it is frostbite, is there any treatment?
Thanks in advance
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Post by Weasel on Aug 14, 2006 9:27:23 GMT -5
Here are the pics.   |
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Post by Weasel on Aug 14, 2006 9:28:04 GMT -5
Frootdog, Any ideas?? I have never seen the likes of this before. Maybe bumblefoot that has infected the whole area.
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Post by jfneumann57 on Aug 14, 2006 10:42:01 GMT -5
that's frost bite
it probably git in it's bath and didn't dry all the way before nightcame/strong winds kicked up.
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Post by jfneumann57 on Aug 14, 2006 10:49:59 GMT -5
bring him inside. give it some asprin. and give it a 20-30 min warm water bath about 100 degrees farenheit (bewarned it will hurt him some) once a day keep him from picking at it. if it's really bad as in condition doesn't start to change in a few days surgery maybe required
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Post by jfneumann57 on Aug 14, 2006 10:50:17 GMT -5
do not i repeat not put him back outside
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Post by femoralis on Aug 14, 2006 15:27:19 GMT -5
It makes a lot of sense. Thank you much.
OK, I'll do that. Do you think he has not to be outside even during the day? Temps outside during the day are abt 50/60 F.
What would be the range of temps necessary during the night?
How much aspirin should I give him? The hunting weight would be 510 grs and 550/570 after eating.
Do you agree with continuing with antibiotics?
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Post by jfneumann57 on Aug 14, 2006 17:28:03 GMT -5
keep indoors until healed all the way once u get frostbite it's easy to get again. to avoid wind and such if u have a giant hood put him in it. keep up w/ antibiotics and as for the asprin crush about 1/2 a child's asprin. if neone want's to know the reason for ne of the treatment suggestions just ask
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Post by jfneumann57 on Aug 14, 2006 18:06:11 GMT -5
is the antibotic a broad spectrum one or a specific one? if you don't know, what is it she prescribed? Does your vet handle many raptors? or birds in general for that matter.
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Post by frootdog on Aug 14, 2006 21:21:17 GMT -5
Weasel as I already said the pics confirm my suspicions. Frostbite. The bird is basically outside in below freezing temps. Do NOT give asprin. DO continue with broad spectrum antibiotics such as Baytril and say a LOT of prayers. The black areas will probably slough and could lead to secondary bumble foot. It should be treated at this point as stage 1 or 2 bumblefoot. That one toe will need to be amputated and the others look like they may be OK. Keep the bird inside. Do warm water hyrotherapy to increase bloodflow to the toes.
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Post by jfneumann57 on Aug 14, 2006 22:37:48 GMT -5
low level asprin reduces the pain level and thins the blood
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Post by femoralis on Aug 14, 2006 23:10:41 GMT -5
The antibiotics I am giving is Dithingyol retard (streptomicine + penicillin). But it makes the bird to vomit in a drastic way and seems not to be well absorbed under the skin.
I will consult again with the local vet and start with aspirin as you recommend.
Thank you much for your recommendations.
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Post by jfneumann57 on Aug 15, 2006 0:15:22 GMT -5
i think eurithromyacin (prob spelled wrong )would work to stem off ne secondary infections i haven't heard of many birds having a reaction to it and it's administered orally. the bactacin ointment is a good idea for cleaning the wound. as fo the asprin it' a one time thing. u don't want to give it to him daily. i'd wait week or so after treatment before concidering amputation.
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